Apparently the protesters are due to come out again soon with the aim of lowering petrol prices.

So - are you in agreement with them, or do you think the prices we pay are justified.

Are you like me, and when the merest sniff of a protest looms, you fill your car to the maximum ... just incase you cant buy any for weeks ?


Im torn. Thinking selfishly Mr.B cant work as he needs petrol to teach people to drive - BUT the cost of petrol is so high that his bring home pay suffers hugely. And you cant just bump up the price of lessons as you have to be competitive.

So - i do think something needs to be done about fuel costs, but blockades really screw us up.

We have been steadily stock piling for a few days. Our nearest garage prices have now jumped from 96.1p per litre to 101.6p per litre overnight - something is in the air.

As long as I have enough fuel to get me to and from the place where my new electric bike is then I don't care - as I can access things on my electric scooter, work shops etc.

The boys both get bused to school - so that is not my concern.

But in actual fact I am hugely in favour of the the protesters - I do't mind some minor disruption to highlight this fact. Because of our geographical location and lack of any public transport we NEED a vehicle to survive. I am not sure many could actually say that!?

So good on them!! And if I could I would TOOT very loudly to show my support!!

On my way home tonight Tesco here is still 91.9, and that just up today from 89.9 yesterday.

I hope there is no panic or protests, to me it's a bit daft. My car holds 40 litres, if it goes up by 10p it's an extra £4 to fill my car - what's that in real terms? A couple of drinks, a bottle of wine, for some not even a whole pack of fags. I can cope with that for the need and pleasure of driving my own car. Brown will never reduce the tax, he's a Scot for goodness sake! :naughty: The whole world is having to pay more, it's not just us!

I am totally in agreement with the protesters.

I noticed one of our local garages put it's price up recently and deisel is 99p/litre.

And to think the last fuel protest was when prices were around 85p/lite:shock:

What I want to know is, even though the fuel barrel prices are going up, how do the major companies, Shell/Texaxo/etc. keep making so much profit.

My car holds 40 litres, if it goes up by 10p it's an extra £4 to fill my car - what's that in real terms?

£4 a day for people who work in their cars. So thats £20 a week (if working Mon - Fri) and so £80 a month. Quite a lot of money - and could of paid for the monthly shop in tescos.

Edited to say - i might be wrong, but i would of thought that the price of petrol effects other things, namely the food we buy in the shops. If it costs the lorry a lot more to drive from warehouse to shop etc ... we will pay the extra, whether it be in clothes or food.

Panixc buying and stockpiling never works, if anything it creates shortages and helps force prices up .

Round here I've noticed prices coming down in the last few days. On Sunday it had gone up to 99.9 just about everywhere you looked, today it's down to a more reasonable 95.

I'm not keen on the fuel protests. Last time it was aimed at the government's tax hike, but raising fuel prices was what the govt had said it would do all along - and as we elected them we shouldn't protest if they do what they said they'd do all along.

This time the price hike is due to world prices, I don't think a bunch of protesters will be able to change that.

and as we elected them we shouldn't protest if they do what they said they'd do all along.


I have an excuse then!!

I didn't elect them! Labour does diddly squat for country folk and we need diesal or petrol like we need water.

I have an excuse then!!

I didn't elect them! Labour does diddly squat for country folk and we need diesal or petrol like we need water.

Neither did i :laugh: I need diesel too as i live about 10 miles from the nearest shop ...... and we dont get buses to our house either :unsure:

I think i will fill up regularly, just incase. Normally i wait until the red warning light comes on, but i wont at the moment.

I have a voucher that entitles me to 5p off a litre when I get diesel at Sainsburys. I don't use the car that often, so once it is full it lasts for ages.

I am though in favour of the protesters, I am sick of this government constantly targetting car drivers! Don't they get enough from us already?! :ranting:

I am though in favour of the protesters, I am sick of this government constantly targetting car drivers! Don't they get enough from us already?! :ranting:

But isn't this latest price hike due to the effects of Hurricane Katrina shutting down US petrol refineries, forcing the US to buy petrol from abroad, resulting in higher prices for us? It isn't because of anything our government has done, is it?

Are the protests going to make the US reopen their refineries any faster, or maybe persuade hurricanes to be a bit more thoughtful of British drivers?

What i dont understand though is how the US managed to keep their petrol prices so low. I read the other day that the Americans are peed off at having to pay 55p a litre right now. So why are we having to pay £1 ?


They interviewed a guy at a petrol garage who says he make 3p a litre - the rest goes to wherever it goes.

So why does the government insist of making us pay so much ?

But isn't this latest price hike due to the effects of Hurricane Katrina shutting down US petrol refineries, forcing the US to buy petrol from abroad, resulting in higher prices for us? It isn't because of anything our government has done, is it?

Are the protests going to make the US reopen their refineries any faster, or maybe persuade hurricanes to be a bit more thoughtful of British drivers?

Why do we need to buy oil from the US in the first place when we have our own oil in the North Sea? This is a geuine question, I mean Orkney is closer to the North Sea oil rigs than anywhere else in the British Isles yet they pay the most!

Bella - I wonder the same, I am clueless when it comes to 'oil prices' and 'oil derivatives' and who supplies who, and how much to who and why??But that very same question passed through my mind??

This link may help - just click on 'next' each time and you may understand more

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/04/world_the_world0s_oil/html/1.stm

Also do bear in mind oil is fairly cheap in real terms, at 88p per litre this is how it breaks down

Tax 66p
Forecourt profit 5p
Fuel company profit 5p
Crude price plus refining 12p
It's the government that takes most of what you pay, and if you include that on top of that we have to pay Road Tax it makes Britain about the most expensive country in the world to drive.

It's the government that takes most of what you pay, and if you include that on top of that we have to pay Road Tax it makes Britain about the most expensive country in the world to drive.

Thanks for that link Nits - can I ask the more travelled members here a question? Are the roads in England more superior to those abroad [Europe] or in the States or NZ or Aus or anywhere else??

Why do we have such a high premium to pay when it comes to road related items, cars, tax, petrol etc?? We are a tiny Island in comparison to most other countrys, we really are being penalised - do you not think??

Thanks for that link Nits - can I ask the more travelled members here a question? Are the roads in England more superior to those abroad [Europe] or in the States or NZ or Aus or anywhere else??

Why do we have such a high premium to pay when it comes to road related items, cars, tax, petrol etc?? We are a tiny Island in comparison to most other countrys, we really are being penalised - do you not think??

It might have something to do with this govt's avowed policy to steadily increase the cost of motoring to dissuade people from using their cars so much. In that respect you might call it a forward thinking policy.

Yep SF, that's what they keep telling us, but to be honest, I would love to know just where this money is going?? Our roads are certainly no better than any where else, in fact, I would say not as good considering the volume of traffic we have.


We keep being asked to use public transport, and that is why we are being taxed (to fund it), but I still can't get a bus, train, tram - or anything that will get me to work in what takes me 10-15 minutes by car, in less than an hour and a half. I don't have that much time to waste!

It's all a huge con in my mind, more families than ever now have 2 cars (at least), and yet, it has also been proven that about 30% of the working population, could, with a tweak here and there, actually work from home, and don't need to travle at all!

Yep SF, that's what they keep telling us, but to be honest, I would love to know just where this money is going?? Our roads are certainly no better than any where else, in fact, I would say not as good considering the volume of traffic we have.


We keep being asked to use public transport, and that is why we are being taxed (to fund it), but I still can't get a bus, train, tram - or anything that will get me to work in what takes me 10-15 minutes by car, in less than an hour and a half. I don't have that much time to waste!

It's all a huge con in my mind, more families than ever now have 2 cars (at least), and yet, it has also been proven that about 30% of the working population, could, with a tweak here and there, actually work from home, and don't need to travle at all!

I agree that the public transport alternatives are not very good, even if it's not slower by train or bus it usually costs more, especially if there are two or three of you travelling.

Car pooling is one option, I still think most cars you see travelling into work during the rush hour have just one occupant.

Another is to make fewer journeys, I'm sure most of us make unnecessary ones and with a bit of thought could cut it down.

THe final one is an eventual change to the way we structure our lives. Up until now the fact that we can jump into our cars any time has meant people choosing to work a long distance from home, and doing the journey by car. If the cost of driving becomes prohibitively expensive we might see people choosing to live much closer to work in the future. I thnk that would be a great thing, think of the personal travelling time saved, and the reduced pollution as well.

BEWARE!

Fuel protesters plan M4 blockade


Fuel protesters in Wales say they will stage a blockade on the M4 next Friday in the wake of rising petrol prices.
The South Wales Hauliers' Association made the vow after a meeting of 60 hauliers and taxi and coach operators.

Earlier this week organisers of the 2000 fuel protests said they would act again if fuel tax was not cut.

The Treasury says cutting tax would not solve the problem of oil prices forced up after refineries in the US were knocked out by Hurricane Katrina.

Fuel Lobby has threatened to block all UK refineries on 14 September, as the price of unleaded petrol rose to more than £1 a litre in parts of the UK.

'Just the start'

The Wales protesters plan to stage a 20mph rolling blockade along the M4 from 0700 BST on Friday 16 September.

Beginning at Cross Hands in west Wales, they will travel along the motorway to the Magor Services near Newport.


More - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4231954.stm

The South Wales Hauliers' Association made the vow after a meeting of 60 hauliers and taxi and coach operators.

I suppose I'd like to see cheaper fuel avaiable for taxis and coaches and buses because they help contribute towards keeping privately owned cars off the roads.

On the other hand I would like to see far less lorries on the roads, so rather than making it cheaper for them to operate I'd sooner see alternatives open up, such as making it more cost effective to send long distance freight by train rather than on the roads.

Yes, I do agree, although I am so going to suffer if this does happen!


At the back of my house is a freight rail track, when I bought the house I was told that mayabe 2 trains a day would chug past, none after 4pm and none at weekends. Now one year later I am getting them 24/7, the whole house shakes like mad, even lightbulbs have to be screwed back in as they loosen. I know my value has plummeted, and there is nothing I can do about it. :mad2:

Sorry to hear about your house Eternity - does it really mean the value has gone down?? Was the no. of trains passing your house when you bought it - binding??

We had some friends round for dinner and talke turned to the Fuel Protests - Andrew, a farmer said he was one of the protesters last time around. And he was amazed and astounded at the level of public support. The protesters were supplied with boxes and boxes of food, fish and chips, sandwiches etc - and crates of fizzy pop. They recieved near on 100% toots from passing motorists.

Of course, I am in favour of the protests and lowering the tax on fuel - but we need our car to go anywhere at all. But I am also very much in favour of reducing the amount of vehicles on the road. [hence my electric bike Luigi - instead of 2 cars for the family]. So how does the government do this fairly??

If they continue to raise the cost of fuel, the cost of grain and produce [cereals, milk, cheese, meat, etc] will go up - the farmer has to claw back some of the cost of rising fuel. Why should my coucil tax go towards a public transport system - when we don't have one? And then on top of that have to pay rising fuel costs?? It is unfair and biased.

I agree with everything you have saif Flippy.


We are a two car family - but Mr.B needs his car for his work, and i need to get to work. Although i only work a 15 minute drive away from my office, there are no buses to get me there (well, i lie. They have 2 a day at totally odd times, one being about 6am, and the other at 4pm - neither of which would work for me).

I need my car - and its too far to cycle. We have began using our bikes more and more, which i love. But we tend to only use them to go to the pub and the one shop in our area.

According to the news on GMTV, the protest starts this Wednesday at 6am. I will be filling up my car this evening, as im guessing the queues tomorrow will be appalling. Im running near empty, and a full tank if used wisely should last me 1.5 weeks.

I am in support of what the protesters are doing, and i dont agree with being taxed non stop. We all pay our road tax, so why should we pay the government so much tax on fuel ? Im sure they can bring it down slightly to help motorists out and stop the protest happening.

You know, these hauliers could have made things so much worse if they had wanted to, and for that fact alone they have my full support. Just imagine them all refusing to work at all for, say, a week?? The country would grind to a halt, and that would do real damage.

No Flip, there was nothing binding, but from the 2 trains a day it was, we have now jumped up to 16 last count, numbers rising all the time. When I asked Railtrack about this, they said it was going to get busier! :mad2:

They could eternity - and im glad they have given motorists a few days warning to fill up their cars rather than say one morning that the protest started NOW

You know, these hauliers could have made things so much worse if they had wanted to, and for that fact alone they have my full support.

Using that argument, does it mean that anybody who does something antisocial gets your support if they could have done worse? Do you support mugging because after all they could have killed someone if they had wanted to?

They could eternity - and im glad they have given motorists a few days warning to fill up their cars rather than say one morning that the protest started NOW

So an immediate result of their action is to cause panic buying. Not a good thing surely?

So an immediate result of their action is to cause panic buying. Not a good thing surely?

No it isnt a good thing - but i for one need to fill up my tank, as im nearly on empty.

Im sure a lot of people will just make sure their tanks are full come wednesday morning. Its not panic buying, but logical. If i didnt have any petrol i couldnt get to work, and if most people are like me the country as a whole would grind to a halt.

You know I was thinking hard about this today [primarily cos my 'Luigi' electric has not arrived] - but how on earth can one stock pile??

Yes of course, you can fill your tank - ours takes over 80 quids worth of fuel - but after that you may be able to fill a couple of 5 gallon portable tanks - but hardly enought to actually stockpile?

What do they mean??

Using that argument, does it mean that anybody who does something antisocial gets your support if they could have done worse? Do you support mugging because after all they could have killed someone if they had wanted to?

No SF, maybe I didn't word that quite right, but I am behind them all the same. I am getting a bit sick of this going up, and that going up all the time. Petrol costs are just 25% of what we actually pay, the government's taxes are causing most of the problem, and they could forgo adding that right now. The actual petrol increase is no more than 5p - the rest is extra tax to this lot in power.

You know I was thinking hard about this today [primarily cos my 'Luigi' electric has not arrived] - but how on earth can one stock pile??

Yes of course, you can fill your tank - ours takes over 80 quids worth of fuel - but after that you may be able to fill a couple of 5 gallon portable tanks - but hardly enought to actually stockpile?

What do they mean??


<ahem. cough> ...

We have been steadily stock piling for a few days. Our nearest garage prices have now jumped from 96.1p per litre to 101.6p per litre overnight - something is in the air.

Have a little lie down, dear.

No it isnt a good thing - but i for one need to fill up my tank, as im nearly on empty.

Im sure a lot of people will just make sure their tanks are full come wednesday morning. Its not panic buying, but logical. If i didnt have any petrol i couldnt get to work, and if most people are like me the country as a whole would grind to a halt.

Oh dear - look at this! (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4236676.stm)

When the last big blockades were on, we were driving down to Ballydehob from Cork. The Irish hauliers main blockade was in a pub. The lorries were all parked off the road so's not to bother the folks who needed to be somewhere. :laugh:

<ahem. cough> ...



Have a little lie down, dear.

Oh I know - but my stockpiling involves me going to the garage and sticking 20 quids worth in to the tank, then the next time, even though it is not empty sticking another 20 quids worth in. I have yet to have a full tank though. And we haven't got extra tanks.

I don't blame people quite honestly. If you have to get to work, or work in your car - and you suspect that you may run out - why not go and buy some??

Did you know in the UK we produce millions of gallons of rape seed oil that we sell to Germany, they make it into fuel to run their cars and it is cheap!

The British Gov. have banned us doing the same - BECAUSE they cannot reap the tax from it!!!:mad2:

THe thing is, if people just bought normally, you wouldn't get petrol stations running dry, as happened yesterday. Ironically, by thinking there might be a fuel shortage when there isn't one, people have actually caused a fuel shortage!

I remember once, years back, when (I can't remember the reasons) the press suggested there might be a bread shortage, and me going to the supermarket and seeing housewives with trolleys full of bread (presumably following the adage 'sod everyone else, as long as I'm alright') so of course the shelves ran dry within an hour.

It seems to be in our natures to panic buy at the sniff of a problem, rather than just buying normally.

We are supposedly a nation of rational people, yet heaven forbid we ever have a major crisis, it will be a case of every man for himself, grab grab grab and sod everyone else. Sixty years ago there was the famous 'war spirit' where everyone was able to live frugally, looked out for everyone else, and pulled together - can anyone honestly believe we would do dthe same these days if faced with a national crisis? We are used to having want we want and having it NOW - that's our inheritance from the Thatcher years and by golly we're not going to give it up are we?

No SF, this goes way back before the Thatcher years, and was the main reason me and mine left the UK in the mid 70's. "I'm all Right Jack" was even before then and meant the same thing -"Sod you mate, I'm OK"


Lay the blame at Maggie's door when it's due blame, but this was old hat well before she took office.

It seems to be in our natures to panic buy at the sniff of a problem, rather than just buying normally.

We are supposedly a nation of rational people, yet heaven forbid we ever have a major crisis, it will be a case of every man for himself, grab grab grab and sod everyone else. Sixty years ago there was the famous 'war spirit' where everyone was able to live frugally, looked out for everyone else, and pulled together - can anyone honestly believe we would do dthe same these days if faced with a national crisis? We are used to having want we want and having it NOW - that's our inheritance from the Thatcher years and by golly we're not going to give it up are we?

Last time there was a petrol protest i did continue to buy normally - in fact, i had quarter of a tank that should of been enough to last me ..... but it didnt and all the garages sold out. I can remember listening to the local radio with my husband in the evenings, and they would announce that a certain garage had petrol, and then calculating that if we got there and they had run out again, could we travel home !!! I then couldnt travel to work (it was before i went by train, but again when i work more local to where i lived). At the time there were a few buses which i ended catching, but i didnt get to work until late, and had to leave early to catch the last bus home. My boss wasnt a happy bunny.

Im not going to risk doing it again - especially when im relatively new in my job.

Its ok for the people who dont need to travel anywhere and can just sit from their arm chairs laughing at the rest of us. So long as you can walk to your nearest shop - and have food in the freezer you could last weeks.

Some of us need cars to buy food and to work.

Luckily this blockade is only continuing 3 days - so in this instance people shouldnt be panic buying. I filled my car up yesterday as i was on empty, and there wasnt a queue in our garage which was good news.

We have a petrol garage directly opposite my house, I am looking at it at the mo as I type. There is a queue there and even at midnight last night there was a queue. I have heard tempers raised and some colourful language, also being on a main road, it is causing havoc with the drivers and so quite a few horns are blaring out now and again.

Edited to say that both our vehicles are filled up and I won't be adding any more fuel to my car until this is over. I will just drive sparingly as I have that option, but lots of people don't have that option, including Mr tiggs, who needs his van for work.

in this instance people shouldnt be panic buying. .

I agree - but they are.

the government's taxes are causing most of the problem, and they could forgo adding that right now. The actual petrol increase is no more than 5p - the rest is extra tax to this lot in power.

But ten years ago, petrol duty made up 73% of the cost of a litre of petrol, today it is 66%, so in real terms the tax is dropping. It is the rising cost of oil that is causing a problem.

I heard that this morning, too Swerve. I still think though that 66% tax on petrol is horrendous. I know it makes a huge amount of money for the Government, which they would then say saves them piling it onto something else, which is therefore saving us money.......... blah.......... blah. If they did lower the tax and spread it around elsewhere, I don't think that would necessarily encourage us to buy more cars or drive more often.

Truth is, they know they've got us over a barrel :blink: because most of us are heavily reliant on our cars. My husband and I both use cars for work, so there's no way we could manage with only one.

I heard that this morning, too Swerve. I still think though that 66% tax on petrol is horrendous. I know it makes a huge amount of money for the Government, which they would then say saves them piling it onto something else, which is therefore saving us money.......... blah.......... blah. If they did lower the tax and spread it around elsewhere, I don't think that would necessarily encourage us to buy more cars or drive more often.

Truth is, they know they've got us over a barrel :blink: because most of us are heavily reliant on our cars. My husband and I both use cars for work, so there's no way we could manage with only one.

I was reading this morning that although petrol duty is higher than most other European countries , it actually isn't loads higher (eg . Italy 63%, Denmark 64%, Germany 65%, France 66%) And when you take into account the overall cost of driving, other European countries have costs that we don't have (for instance motorway tolls and hefty car purchase tax)) which perhaps should be taken into account.

I was reading this morning that although petrol duty is higher than most other European countries, it actually isn't loads higher. And when you take into account the overall cost of driving, other European countries have costs that we don't have (for instance motorway tolls).

I would rather we pay motorway toll costs to be honest. I still dont understand how our fuel can be double what they pay in the US - it has to be the government side of things.

I agree - but they are.



But ten years ago, petrol duty made up 73% of the cost of a litre of petrol, today it is 66%, so in real terms the tax is dropping. It is the rising cost of oil that is causing a problem.

Yes, so Gordon Brown keeps telling us, but he's doing his trick of fiddling with figures - as ever. There is a graph going round that gives the lie to this (oh what a surprise!), but I am off to work in a minute, if I find it I will post now, else it will be this evening.

I do agree with a comment on another site re all this. Brown says the tax is for the environment to cut emissions? So why has he asked oil producers to increase production to keep up demand today? He's a lying barsteward! :mad2:

I would rather we pay motorway toll costs to be honest. I still dont understand how our fuel can be double what they pay in the US - it has to be the government side of things.

Other countries also don't have the high road taxes we have, and they are mandatory regardless of how many miles you do. You can choose to drive on Toll roads in Europe, and few do!

I am hoping that panic buyers will clear out all my local petrol stations, in which case I, a sensible non-panicker, will be unable to get to work. :cool:


Mwahahah .

I would rather we pay motorway toll costs to be honest. .

But I'm guessing you don't use motorways every day like many drivers do? They might have a different take on it.

Simple economics trick saying the tax on fuel is a smaller %. To show one thing you use the proportional value, to show another you use the absolute.

In absolute terms, fuel duty hasn't changed much being about 47p per litre, although the Exchequer benefits secondarily from the increased VAT revenue (now 14p per litre (for about 95p litre), up about 2p due to the recent rises).

Proportionally, duty now makes up a lower proportion of the cost than it did before the recent price rises. 47p + 14p out of about 95p (abut 65%) is less than the 47p + 12p of an 85p litre (about 70%)

But I'm guessing you don't use motorways every day like many drivers do? They might have a different take on it.

No - i dont use motorways - i use a lot of dual carridgeways though. I wouldnt mind if they had tolls on those too. I would rather spent £1 there and £1 home if it meant petrol was the price they pay in the states. I still think we would all save money.

Bons, petrol in the States has gone up huge amounts also. It was going up before Katrina even hit.

When we reached North Carolina we were paying $2.23 a gallon compared to a year or so ago when it was just $1.09. By the time we left three weeks later it was $2.53. At the height of Katrina it rose to $3.59 but now has levelled to $3.09. From what I understand, (and someone correct me if I am wrong) if you convert the litres to gallons and dollars to pounds, the gap is closing swiftly. And these hikes are just what took place over one month.

[font=Arial]Simple economics trick saying the tax on fuel is a smaller %. To show one thing you use the proportional value, to show another you use the absolute.

In absolute terms, fuel duty hasn't changed much being about 47p per litre,

Cat't see where the trick is though Eternity. I just had a look at the stats on the BBC news site.

Looking at prices in 2000 when the previous protests took place:

2000: price of a litre 76p, of which duty = 77%

According to my workings out, that would make the actual duty 58p per litre then.

So whichever way you look at it (relative or absolute) the duty has come down (unless I've got my sums wrong)

heres a link to the BBC item here (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/05/business_petrol_pricing/html/4.stm)

We've had price hikes on fuel here too, in fact it's risen 35% this year and rose a further 5 cents in the wake of Katrina. According to NZ news online we had a slight dip in prices yesterday:

BP lowered prices by 2 cents a litre yesterday, charging 153.9c for 91-octane, 158.9c for 96 and 99.9c for diesel.

Spokeswoman Diana Stretch said crude and refined oil prices had eased enough for the company to lower prices at the pump.

Production and refining capacities in the United States were coming "back on line" after Hurricane Katrina, she said.

Shell lowered the price of 91 by 2 cents a litre to 153.9 cents and dropped the price of 96 by 3 cents to 157.9c. Diesel was 99.9c a litre.

Asked if motorists could expect further drops in prices, spokeswoman Jackie Maitland said: "We'll have to wait and see what happens with international prices."

http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/0,2106,3408417a11,00.html

We have a general election here this week (polling day on Saturday) so it's big news at the moment and fuel price rises are being blamed on Katerina, and touted as temporary, though it doesn't explain the total price rise for the year of course!

Very interesting link here, check all 6 pages/graphs out


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/05/business_petrol_pricing/html/1.stm

Re chart #3. I still want to know where this revenue is going. It has been said on education and the NHS services, but we have already been told those were the reasons for the hike in Council Tax. Something is stinking foul play to me, the sooner this bunch of tossers are ejected (NooLabour), the better chance we have of sorting out the financial disaster we are in. This country is so heavily in debt now, and yet we are paying more in taxes than ever before by more devious ways.

Something is stinking foul play to me,

Are you still of the opinion that the reduction in petrol duty over tha past years is a case of someone fiddling the figures to fool people?

Absolutely SF, there has been no reduction at all in the duty 'paid' on fuel, that is a fact. If you take VAT into consideration (that is a duty tax), then the duty has in fact increased!


I did intend to get back to this, but had a warning yesterday that I may be a candidate for redundancy - and that was all I had time to think about I'm afraid! :mad2:

Absolutely SF, there has been no reduction at all in the duty 'paid' on fuel, that is a fact. If you take VAT into consideration (that is a duty tax), then the duty has in fact increased!

I don't doubt you Eternity - it's just that the BBC stats I mentioned earlier seem to show otherwise, although admittedly they don't include VAT increases.

Can I ask - are you basing your statement on figures that you have managed to find - if so could you show them or give a link to them please?

From Yahoo

Motorists look set for some relief at the forecourts amid forecasts the cost of a litre of petrol could fall by as much as 4p next week.

Experts said petrol prices were likely to fall from their current average of 96p a litre as refineries start pumping extra oil stocks following the intervention of the International Energy Agency.

Chris Hunt, director general of the UK Petroleum Industry Association, said prices could ease by 3p or 4p as this starts to enter the system.

He said: "Prices
should be back down to pre-Katrina levels as that filters through over the next week or so."

The cost of a barrel of oil in New York now stands below 64 US dollars - off the record high of more than 70 US dollars seen in the wake of Hurricane Katrina.

A spokesman for the AA Motoring Trust said the group was "cautiously" expecting a fall in petrol prices but added: "These things take time to work through."

In addition to the impact of Hurricane Katrina, he said a lot of people were unlikely to need petrol for a few days since they filled up their tanks on Tuesday. This in turn should ease demand and bring down prices.

Motorists rushed to garages to fill up their vehicles amid fears fuel protests could disrupt supplies.

However, the protest failed to materialise with just a handful of demonstrators taking part.

"It's going to take a lot of pressure off a lot of people, not just motorists but also the oil companies," he said.

On the news last night it was reported that only a few protecters showed up at the depots.

One man was shown being dragged from his car by the police....he was shouting his head off and saying they were hurting his back. During the struggle somehow his trousers had come down!! The police tried to cover him up, but he wouldn't let them saying they had made them come down so they could stay down.

The thing I don't get is.....why didn't he jsut get out of his car when they asked him too - he seemed to want to cause a scene and get himself hurt to get on TV......very odd!