Last November the Government put the cost of Lord Saville's Bloody Sunday inquiry at £163 million. However, Tessa Jowell, let slip on BBC TV's Sunday AM programme that "the latest estimate. . . is about £400 million".

WTF????

Are they paying £5000 to every single person they ask a question about this incident that took place 34 years ago?

I dont have any particular comment about the event itself, but surely there are more urgent things that we could have spent £400million on over the last 8 years?

Full article (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2006/07/05/nterr05.xml&sSheet=/news/2006/07/05/ixuknews.html)

The WORST thing is...nobody will be charged over the incident.This inquiry is just a a 'fact finding mission'.But Everyone knows the facts of that Bloody Sunday.(Well.everyone except lord Widgery, obviously.)Personally...I think the british army should be held responsible for shooting dead innocent people,on a civil rights march.And if this inquiry offers some kind of closure to the victims..then so be it.But this inquiry has been going on for years.
The lawyers are raking it in.

(For people over here it's not just an isolated incident that happened 34 years ago.That particular day is still a vivid memory for a lot of people, and it changed the nature of the conflict.It got bloodier and nastier after that date.)

Yeah, I thought I made it clear that the thread was about the cost of the inquiry, not the event that occurred 34 years ago.

So, anyway, about the 400 million quid?

I know...and you did.I was just responding to the bit in your post about 'an incident that happened 34 years ago'.I know a lot of people will think this a total waste of money, over an event which occured ages ago.And you can be damned sure the final cost will amount to more than that 400 million.
But what price truth? I would rather see money being spent on something as important as that inquiry, than on other ridiculous costs in the 6 counties.
Like..paying MLA's salaries for the last few years..even thought the Assembly has been suspended.And paying their expenses..even though they are not sitting.And paying astronomical security bills for Tony Blair or Bush whenever they decide to go visit and preach about violence never solving anything.
Or all the grants that are given to the Orange lodges etc etc.
And HEY...if a proper inquiry had been held in the first place OR if they had not waited 26 years before agreeing to this inquiry, I'm sure the cost would have been waaaaaaaaaaaay less.

I hate to admit having a few cynical thoughts on this matter. But 400 million does sound excessive. I also think it rings of bribery and corruption to keep mouths shut for the sake of protecting the embarrassment of the then Government plus a few military heads. If so I must say it won't have been the first cover up in our life time and probably not the last.

I do think in relation to the London bombings there are questions which need answering and there are obviously muslim issues we need to address. Muslim leaders want to do this now but the Government is dragging its heels somewhat.

The last paragraph of the editorial posted by Groucho is in direct conflict with another editorial published this week about 500 Drs, Nurses and GP's all off on full pay as a result of a leak uncovered via the Freedom of Information Act, due to health trusts cancelling operations.

It's a vicious circle.

Maureen
Northern angel.

Are they paying £5000 to every single person they ask a question about this incident that took place 34 years ago?
No, of course not.


It's £444,000 per witness.


I agree with Aond that the inquiry needed doing, but the cost beggars belief.

Interesting Japanese similarity only the other day where apparantly, the person who translated Rushdie's Satanic Verses into Japanese was killed at a university here.

That was 15 years ago, and they never foundthe murderer, but the news story the other day was that there is a statute of limitations in Japan of 15 years, which meant that midnight a few days ago, whoever did the murder could not be arrested/convicted if found.

The story mentioned that 35,000 officers (thirty five thousand!) had worked on the case over the 15 years.

But yes I agree, the UK Bloody Sunday case sounds even more excessive.

Interesting indeed.
Were they trying to establish if it was state sanctioned murder?

(that is not me being smart..that is a genuine question..I dont' have time to google it at the mo)

As well as the cost (and it's presumably related) what gets me is the length of time these things take - wasn't the inquiry ordered in 1997 or 8, that's 9 years so far and still going.

Agree that the money could be spent on better things, but note the Tory response - the last item.

Tory figures say the inquiry has cost everyone in the country £6.64; the total of £400 million would have paid for more than 15,000 nurses, nearly 5,000 doctors and 11,000 policemen, or 13 extra Apache helicopters for troops in Iraq and Afghanistan.

If you took 1000 Whitehall mandarins and paid them all £50,000 for 8 years, it would cost £400million.

I just cant comprehend how the cost could have reached this level, even after 8 or 9 years!:blink:

Consultants, Groucho. That's my bet.

My uncle is a retired Whitehall bod and when he gets called in, his day rate annualised is way moe than 50k (plus costs - first class rail, lunches etc.

Don't think he's worked on this as he's more involved with terrorism.

And he reckons compared to others, he's undercharging.

I also heard a report on the radio recently that the Government have no idea how much is spent on management consultants as there is no way of maintaining records. Their defence of this was that it would cost too much to set up a department to monitor this spend. Imagine running that one past the shareholders :bored:

So I reckon they'll have drafted in independent 'experts' (ie retired civil servants) for this investigation and won't have a clue what the money's been spent on.

Apart from the consultants fees you have got the security cost...protection of the soldiers when they give evidence....the researchers....the media costs, press office....cost of stenographers and all the administration work.The transcripts have to made available in cd format etc etc.
You have the cost of television screens....(some of the sittings have live broadcasts so that the public outside the Guild hall can follow it also.This is done via relay screens.) Even the cost of providing press facilities!
The cost of flying in the 'experts', the cost of accomoding them.The cost of tracking down the foreign press present on that day and again putting them up while they give evidence.The Belly Telly (Belfast Telegraph) last year said that a lot of money was paid in solicitors fees: After the massacre, a lot of those who witnessed it were urged to go and give statements to their solicitors.These would have to be formally requested by the Inquiry solicitors, and we all know the cost of a solicitors letter is not cheap.
And of course, the cost of moving the whole tribunal from Derry to London at one stage.I'd say that cost a pretty penny.And also, even though this second inquiry was agreed in 1998 and didn't start sitting till' late 2000, many of those judges and consultants had already been receiving their salaries from day one!!!!!!

As well as the cost (and it's presumably related) what gets me is the length of time these things take - wasn't the inquiry ordered in 1997 or 8, that's 9 years so far and still going.

Agree that the money could be spent on better things, but note the Tory response - the last item.

Tory figures say the inquiry has cost everyone in the country £6.64; the total of £400 million would have paid for more than 15,000 nurses, nearly 5,000 doctors and 11,000 policemen, or 13 extra Apache helicopters for troops in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Hello Survivorfan,

You know in all due fairness here, I don't think it would matter who was in power the opposition party would have used similar statistical information in the same way. Especially so when issues of the NHS, Law and order and Defense spending will always be at the fore front of political debate.

The idea of spending up to and possibly more than £400 million on research and reports, some 34 years on seems ridiculous and in addition will not tell the government anything new from the original transcripts. The prima face evidence at the time, which has obviously been ignored and as a result successive governments have failed to learn future lessons of importance.

Hence the recent London bombings research reports and dossiers will be somewhat smaller and less costly. The present government in the current climate do not want to incurr any more excessive charges against it.

Maureen
Northern angel.

[QUOTE=Northern angel]
in addition will not tell the government anything new from the original transcripts.

Unfortunately Mo..there was very little original transcripts produced at the first tribunal.Widgery did not even consider any of the eyewitness statements given on the day of the massacre or shortly afterwards.
Hence this second inquiry.

Best I could figure about the UK justice system is that when you get to an age that you have to start wearing nappies again, you get to make decisions that affect the nation.

..and other nations too..unfortunately.

I also heard a report on the radio recently that the Government have no idea how much is spent on management consultants as there is no way of maintaining records. Their defence of this was that it would cost too much to set up a department to monitor this spend. Imagine running that one past the shareholders :bored:

So I reckon they'll have drafted in independent 'experts' (ie retired civil servants) for this investigation and won't have a clue what the money's been spent on.

See, the thing is, and how to I put this eloquently..........the government are full off s*** if thats their reason for not knowing the full costs of Consultants.....having worked in Finance for the last 20 years, even me, a mere Financial Controller, knows that ALL Expenditure must be allocated a "COST CENTRE" and what we call a "NOMINAL CODE" - this makes sure that you can run a little report off your "Nominal Ledger" (sorry if you are all nodding off with the boredom:laugh: ) which then shows HOW MUCH has been spent.........

For example, take a nationwide organisation like Lunn Poly, they will have NOMINAL CODES for RENT, GAS, ELECTRIC etc, then the individual SHOP will have its own unique CODE which is its COST CENTRE - that way, the Finance Director can tell at a glance what the overall running costs are for each individual shop........

In my old firm we did it by Dept as it was a smaller organisation, but its a FUNDEMENTAL RULE of accounts, so if the GOVERNMENT aint got THAT bit right then Im really concerned!!!

BACK OT.........IT seems an awful lot of money £400m........